9 replies to this topic

[AndY]

In a Feedback Series we unveiled this past summer, we had asked our community a few questions about Overwatch, answers to which have helped us plan for the future.

We'd discussed Overwatch Love & Favourite Features, Sides & Least Favourite Features, Ground Players (Resistance), Overhead Players (Overwatch/GM) and a Radical Change, but it seems there is one question we hadn't asked (or hadn't asked properly):

What do you like and dislike about Overwatch's four official levels (Breach, Canals, Citadel, Crossroads)?

The levels are obviously very different from one another (each offering some unique gameplay twists), so rather than just asking you to pick your favourite out of the four, we'd like you to give us a short list of primary likes/dislikes for each.


Don't hold back!

[Sabre]

Ok, time to for me to voice my controversial opinion.

My favourite maps are Breach then Citidel.

Breach is very themeatic and straight forward, with varied objectives and fun gun fights for ground players, and lots of tactical and fun stuff for the OW player. So many in fact that unlike other maps, you can't go "Did he choose X or Y?" at specific points. Outside of turret locations and the sniper tower, the GPs can't 'know' the map. The lack of time limit allows for many tactical options too. Take it slow, rush through, orginized series of pushes. All technically viable, all counterable.

Citidel I like for many of the same reasons, though the lack of viable tactical variance on the GP side is a let down. It's stay together or get picked off. It makes up for it in the sence of escalation. The main issue, from what I played anyway, is that it's clear early on if the GPs will win or not. Usually the GPs die before the first 2 consoles, or they win, it's rare I see a GP loss after 2 console are down. (although if you count dying during the escape as a draw, that happens a fair bit too)

Crossroads I like a bit. It can be frustrating on both sides due to turrets/headcrabs for GP, and units getting distracted or stuck on zombies for the OP. Having guys run off can be either fun or not, depending on how stupid a move it was. Being on zombie duty can be dull too.

Canals I dont like, yet it always seems to win map votes. It's imballenced to the point of being broken for low player counts. Victories for either side tend to feel hollow, and while the GPs have options, they are pretty limited. Arguments and QQing over the RPGs can be a pain, as is getting hit by a breaching charge. Enemies always appear round the top, so until the end there isn't much in terms of suprises or varied placement. It's very much "Does he have manhacks in the side tunnel?" "Is he going to go for manhacks or SMGs?" That is also reflected in the OP player. I don't feel I have choices beyond "More manhacks or SMGs?" which don't feel particularly meaningful.

So, as a bullet point list, here's what I like and don't.

Likes (as seen in breach and citidel)
-Theme/story
-Strategic options on both sides
-Variation (enemies not always in the same places, lack of a 'best' solution)

Dislikes are pretty much the opposate of the above.
-Seeing 'the matrix' (is the OW player choosing X or Y. Having to micro to stop the AI freaking out. Having to manipulate the game as 1s and 0s instead of resistence v combine)
-Lack of options or not having a meaningful effect on the outcome.
-Forgone conclusions. (knowing how a game is going to play out barring some sort of wild card)

I hope I made myself clear, let me know if not.

Edited by Sabre, 16 February 2012 - 03:50 PM.

[WAXT]

Breach
Breach is a well balanced map with differing objectives every round. It's hard to find anything wrong with breach, especially with a Strider-showdown on the way, but why are there no rollermines? Breach's layout makes for perfect rollermine territory -there's plenty of open space, plenty of areas to escape them and plenty of grenades to kill them. (Rollermines explode after only one grenade hit.) Rollermines are also the perfect way to break up a well co-ordinated rebel team.
Likes:

• Map Duration
  
• Well Balanced
  
• Varying Objectives

Dislikes:

• No rollermines (It's the perfect map!)

Canals
Canals is an exciting map to play. It's fast-paced gameplay makes it fun to play and also ensures plenty of rounds are played before the next map rotation. The auto-revive feature makes team-work a must but also allows the rebels to focus on the task at hand. Hoppermines are always fun but playing the Overwatch requires little skill as you'll win everytime provided you spawn enough soldiers. The chopper is also good for a fight but lacks any real purpose -perhaps changing the final objectives into a chopper-showdown finale? The chopper's damage also needs to be increased and adding a "drop mines" ability would also be awesome.
Likes:

• Fast-paced Gameplay
  
• Auto-revive Feature
  
• Hoppermines! (Shield Scanners)
  
• Relies heavily on Rebel co-ordination and team-work.
  
• Fantastic Music

Dislikes:

• Playing Overwatch (GM) is basically a spam-fest
  
• Chopper doesn't really serve much purpose
  
• Shield scanners shouldn't disable the final bomb

Citadel
Citadel is another map that's hard to fault. It's layout is great and the objectives are simple yet fun to achieve. There's only really two things that bug me about Citadel. When rebels fall into the abyss/powercore, why are they revived? As far as I'm concerned that should be a permanent death. Also, when the powercore explodes and none of the rebels escape, why do they win? (Has this been fixed?) You could argue that the rebels accomplished their objective by blowing up the Citadel, but then why have them escape at all? Why not have the rebels "hold the point" for 30 seconds and allow the Overwatch a chance to kill all the rebels and deactivate the self-destruct?
Likes:

• Great Layout
  
• Simple Objectives
  
• Reasonably Balanced

Dislikes:

• Rebels that fall into the abyss are auto-revived
  
• Rebels win even when they all perish in the blast

Crossroads
Crossroads is my least liked map. It can be difficult to win as the Overwatch as troop movements are difficult with so many zombies interfering and giving away their position. Playing as the rebels is also rather boring as you're basically waiting at the bunker until the alarm is sounded. The snipers are a nice feature but i feel the damage dealt by them is too minimal.
Likes:

• Snipers
  
• Zombies

Dislikes:

• Combine conflicting with the zombies
  
• The map is rather dull (for the rebels). It's a lot of waiting around
  
• Difficult to win as Overwatch (Imbalanced)
  
• Turrents being knocked over so easily

[Gabe(HUN)]

Time for the review for the OW maps? Ok, Let's see!

1. Breach: one of the oldest maps for the mod, and this my number 1 map. Lot of tactical movement for both sides, various objectives...these are the most greatest points for the map. I missing one of the oldest objectives (combine ball releasing from the generator) and the fact, that the new players haven't got information, what are they doing in the generator destroying objectives ( they trying to shooting the generator with shotguns, SMGs and pistols, not going to find grenades( they trying to destroy the canisters, because they think these are explosives). But still one of my number one map in this version.

2. Citadel: the first textured old map. One of my favourite, but have got some "issues". In the OP side is clear, but the combine movement sometimes going to micromanaging( sometimes they won't come to the battlefield from their's spawnroom), and maybe a little bit Overpowered with his/her shotgun units. In the GP side I don't like two things: 1.: When we are falling down, we get the auto respawn ability: a little bit helpfull, but unrealistic. 2.: when the final console is activated, and the rebels are died, they are still win the round.

3. Canals: Still like this map, but again, a little bit unbalanced. For the OP side this map is going to pistol-cop-spam-fest, with the "manhack-rape" ability, he/she can win the round about 30-60 second flat. The chopper doesn't have much damage, and haven't got too much potential, as I fought in the first 10 play in this map. But the synth scanners... With those guys we can deactivate the bomb, taking damage if they are close to the players, and the most special tactical units as I thought. For the GP side is more than like a racing game: runrunrunrunplantthebombandafterthatsurvive scheme played in every section. In the end I use the RPG to kill the scanners and the cops, not to destroying the chopper. Still hard to win with the rebels, most like luck and a little tactical ability for the players.

4.Crossroads: Well... the least favourite map. With few rebels it is almost impossible to win against the zombie hordes and the combine "rapers" shotguners. And the fact that the deactivation process is a little bit buggy I think. For the OP still hard to win, because the combine AI, and the zombie spawn points. The grenade launchers also blocking the OW's plans to bring the units to the main objective... Another thing are those free rooms, that the GPs can reach...I don't think what is the sense of these... and this map is the most memory eater map or something, because this map crashes the servers most.
This map is the most unbalanced, but I hope you guys can do some positive improvements for that map!

I'm done here! I hope you can create some good improvements for OW and IA! both!

[rickinator9]

WAXT, on 16 February 2012 - 10:00 PM, said:

Have you been playing the dev? Prolly not
-----

I like the crossroads and canals maps best. I don't like the hack maps. When there's an hacking objective in breach, the rebels just bunch up, making it impossible to win. They might go into separate groups in citadel, but it's still a pain to kill them. I would actually like a feature when 1 rebel just needs to hold 'e' to hack something.

Crossroads is a good map, the rebels always have something to do (because of the fast zombies). The overwatch can really develop a strategy more than on any other map.

Canals also is a good map. There's always action around. The only problem I have with it is that there's an explosive barrel spawn right above an objective. That means 1 player rebel teams are pretty much screwed.

[WAXT]

Gabe(HUN), on 17 February 2012 - 06:06 AM, said:

But the synth scanners... With those guys we can deactivate the bomb, taking damage if they are close to the players, and the most special tactical units as I thought.

Good point. I'll need to add that to my list of dislikes -the scanners shouldn't be able to deactivate the bomb.

rickinator9, on 17 February 2012 - 07:38 AM, said:

Have you been playing the dev? Prolly not

My dev version has been unplayable until recently. It turns out my anti-virus was blocking some of the SVN components; it was flagged as being a worm.

[AndY]

WAXT, on 17 February 2012 - 09:39 PM, said:

Good point. I'll need to add that to my list of dislikes -the scanners shouldn't be able to deactivate the bomb.

Already fixed.

WAXT, on 17 February 2012 - 09:39 PM, said:

My dev version has been unplayable until recently. It turns out my anti-virus was blocking some of the SVN components; it was flagged as being a worm.

I hope you're not using AVG or worse.. Norton.

Just kidding of course, but I'd recommend Avast!, Avira or Nod32.

[WAXT]

AndY, on 17 February 2012 - 11:54 PM, said:

I hope you're not using AVG or worse.. Norton.

Kaspersky actually. It quarantines one of the files for a few days. The trouble is it doesn't automatically restore it (once it has been verified as safe/uninfected). Anyway, I got it working and that's what's important.

[Sabre]

Remember when AVG used to be good? Anyway, that's off topic...

One game that did hacking really was Dystopia. As something for overwatch, it wouldn't fit, but it might be worth looking into. Although I "hold e" type objectives because they are not fun. Hacking as a "Hold in this area" excuse is fine, but if the goal is to feel like hacking then holding e would be bad. If the goal is to keep the GPs distracted, then something more involved would work better.

For anyone who hasn't played Dystopia. The hacking can either just be slapped on and left to it's own devices, or you can speed up the process by pressing the buttons in a sequence displayed on screen. This means skilled hackers can hack very quickly, provided then have the skill and focus.

[AndY]

Sabre, on 18 February 2012 - 08:58 PM, said:

For anyone who hasn't played Dystopia. The hacking can either just be slapped on and left to it's own devices, or you can speed up the process by pressing the buttons in a sequence displayed on screen. This means skilled hackers can hack very quickly, provided then have the skill and focus.

I'd rather we keep discussions in the appropriate forum section and not stray too far off topic.